Below you'll find a list of some of the false claims, distortions, and misrepresentations found in Ace Baker's (a.k.a. Collin Alexander) specious 9/11 conspiracy film series entitled 9/11 - The Great American Psy-Opera (specifically chapters 06 What Planes? and 07 The Key) which asserts that the video footage of the airplane attacks on the World Trade Center (all of it) is fake--fabrications of the American Government and complicit news media as part of a false-flag operation to deceive Americans and fellow world citizens.
These slickly produced videos seem to have misled a lot of people on YouTube (receiving over a half million views on one mirrored channel and with overwhelmingly positive responses). On the surface, the presented arguments may sound persuasive, as if they're based on "facts". In truth, they hinge on erroneous assumptions, fallacious reasoning, and dishonest manipulations of the evidence.
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| Ace Baker and his phony "Key".
Ironically, the haircut is real.
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Contained in this
post:
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Only THREE 9/11 airplane videos are confirmed to have been shown LIVE. - From 07 The Key (at 3:30).
FALSE. In fact, this claim
is simply an absolute lie. There were at least seven national
and/or local (or locally affiliated) news stations broadcasting LIVE coverage
on the morning of 9/11/2001, including ABC, CBS, NBC, CNN, FOX, WB11, and local
NY1. six of those stations captured the second plane while
broadcasting live that morning. and one of those networks, CBS captured the
plane with two different live cameras while switching.
This means that seven different news cameras captured the plane while broadcasting LIVE, not "three" as Ace claims.
This means that seven different news cameras captured the plane while broadcasting LIVE, not "three" as Ace claims.
So why does Ace baker claim that only three are confirmed to
have been shown live? What he means is that only three video clips have
been confirmed to have been shown live by him, because only
three of the live clips will work with his fake airplane/composite theory.
Ace asserts that the three live clips "just so happen" to have the necessary attributes which would make live video compositing possible and allow the insertion of a fake, computer animated, airplane into the live video feeds. Those necessary attributes are:
- High contrast between tower and sky.
- "Steady camera" with no panning, tilting, or zooming.
- Airplane path is across sky only.
- Airplane disappears across straight vertical edge.
- Impact wall is hidden.
- No shadows required.
Ace states that, "Absent any one of
these, inserting a fake airplane LIVE, in real time, becomes impossible".
He then asks, "What are the odds
that this occurred by chance?" It becomes clear how
ridiculous this question is, when you take the time to discover that Ace cherry-picked the clips that he says are "confirmed to have been shown
live". So the odds are 100% because he arbitrarily chose which clips are
"real", ignoring everything else.
Below are clips from the three LIVE broadcasts which,
according to Ace, "are confirmed to have been shown
live" and allegedly contain all of the necessary attributes for live compositing:
ABC:
- Notice that, despite Ace's assertion that this shot was "put together nicely", it also clearly shows the alleged "nose-out" mistake:
- Did the "perps" make the same composting error twice? Or is the alleged "nose-out" showing something real?
WB11 (Local WPIX):
FOX Chopper5 (local WNYW):
YouTube:
(full broadcast) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A_SGGwR4GiU
(higher quality clip) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gsXpNymaHBI
Note: Several
replays of the Chopper5
footage aired on FOX throughout the day on 9/11, footage Ace claims was "flushed and never seen again".
See it here and here at 14:45, 32:10, 52:24, and 1:14:10. Seems they didn't mind replaying their self-incriminating "mistake" over and over.
See it here and here at 14:45, 32:10, 52:24, and 1:14:10. Seems they didn't mind replaying their self-incriminating "mistake" over and over.
Below
are the airplane clips that ACE ignores which were also broadcast LIVE on 9/11:
CBS LIVE:
YouTube:
(national broadcast) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JJO1Y0bCykk
(CBS2 NY local broadcast) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=POALezpF9SY
(Raw from Queens) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4A9YVlk3WSI
(national broadcast) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JJO1Y0bCykk
(CBS2 NY local broadcast) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=POALezpF9SY
(Raw from Queens) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4A9YVlk3WSI
- Notice that both of these live camera shots do not meet the necessary criteria for live compositing, because there is not high contrast between tower and sky. This is why Ace does not include them in the "confirmed to have been shown live" category even though there is absolutely no evidence that they were not shown live.
- Does Ace believe that CBS was not covering the WTC attacks live? Of course they were. What then does he believe they were broadcasting at the time of the second strike? Can he provide that for us? Can he provide ANY proof that this clip was not shown live? Of course he can't. If he could he would, so he simply ignores it.
NBC LIVE:
YouTube:
(local broadcast): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BjUUSbWk60M
(national broadcast): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7xomUzh3QOg
(RAW chopper footage): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZAlA-H4QJRo
(LIVE Chopper4 close-up. Yes, it's a plane.)
- Notice
that this clip fails to meet three criteria for live
compositing, including:
- 1. NO high contrast between tower and sky.
- 2.
NOT a "steady camera" with no panning, tilting, or zooming
(it's another chopper camera that's moving AND zooming with the plane in
view).
- 3. Airplane path is NOT across sky only.
- Again,
why does Ace ignore this footage? There is NO reason to believe the NBC
chopper footage was not broadcast live. The reason he ignores it is
because it doesn't work with his contrived luma-key/composite
theory.
NY1 Local LIVE:
- This live clip would not work with Ace's theory, again, because there's not enough contrast between tower and sky.
- This clip, in full resolution format, has the longest view of the plane--25 seconds. For more info on this clip and ALL existing 9/11 airplane videos go to: http://www.911conspiracy.tv/2nd_hit.html
The FOX Chopper5 video contains an editing mistake which reveals that a fake CGI airplane was added to the LIVE video feed. - From 07 The Key
Baker claims that this "mistake" is a smoking-gun which proves that the 9/11 airplane attacks were faked and never happened. The "key" he's referring to is a video editing tool called a "luma-key" which he alleges was used by the TV news media to fabricate LIVE composite videos of the WTC attacks that contain fake CGI airplane animations. Despite his elaborate efforts to sell this theory, however, it fails miserably for several reasons:
In the video below, I demonstrate why the flame-over-nose in the live Fox chopper footage is a dead giveaway that Ace's luma-key theory is impossible.
FALSE. This supposed
mistake has become known as the "nose-out" mistake or "Pinocchio's nose" and Ace Baker refers to this
alleged mistake as "The KEY to solving 9/11" in 07 - The Key.
Baker claims that this "mistake" is a smoking-gun which proves that the 9/11 airplane attacks were faked and never happened. The "key" he's referring to is a video editing tool called a "luma-key" which he alleges was used by the TV news media to fabricate LIVE composite videos of the WTC attacks that contain fake CGI airplane animations. Despite his elaborate efforts to sell this theory, however, it fails miserably for several reasons:
- As mentioned above, a luma key will only work if the original video comprises all the required attributes. As also explained, only three of the seven live airplane videos contained those attributes. Ace Baker's luma-key theory, therefore, cannot be correct since it can't explain or account for the other four existing live clips that captured the 2nd plane.
- The supposed smoking gun of Baker's "theory", the alleged nose-out "mistake" (a.k.a. "Pinocchio's nose"), hangs on the assumption that the apparent nose-shaped "object" observed exiting the north side of Tower 2 during the impact explosion, is indeed the intact nose of the plane. But this assumption is wrong, because it is derived from observing only a small sample of cherry-picked video clips. When all of the video footage of the plane's impact is examined and considered, it becomes quite obvious that the "nose" of the plane is actually an ejection cloud of dust, smoke, and debris. See for yourself here.
- Even if one were stubborn enough to ignore the above two fatal flaws in Baker's "theory", it still fails absolutely. Why? Because the theory has a technical flaw, one that Baker himself has acknowledged but chose to hide from his audience. The flaw is this: The use of a luma-key, for the purpose of adding a fake plane animation to the live video, cannot accurately replicate what is seen in the live FOX footage of the 2nd plane impact. The flaw is a dead giveaway that proves a luma-key was not used in the live FOX Chopper5 footage as Baker has alleged.
Here is an explanation of the technical
flaw in Baker's luma-key "theory" (or just skip to the video explanation below):
If a luma key had been used on the live Fox Chopper video footage, the exiting "nose" of the alleged animated CGI airplane would be visible on top of (in front of) the explosion exiting the tower. A luma-key works off of the luminance (brightness) within the video signal. In order to see an airplane animation that has been sandwiched in between two duplicate layers of video from the same camera feed (3 layers altogether), the top layer would require portions of the image to be cut out, revealing the added airplane layer underneath. When this is done using a luma-key, a predetermined brightness threshold (limit) is set which will prevent any portion of the video image from showing that is brighter than that threshold, making those brighter portions disappear completely. In this case, the brightness threshold would have to be set to a point where it would eliminate the entire sky background (of the top layer only) while leaving the darker Twin Towers intact. The catch is that the flame, caused by the fuel explosion that erupts from the opposite side of the tower, is as bright as the sky. This means that the flame would also disappear just as the sky does, revealing the layer behind it which supposedly contains the animated plane and it's protruding nose. The fact that the flame does NOT disappear, that we see it covering and obscuring the "nose" of the plane, is proof that a luma key was not used.
If a luma key had been used on the live Fox Chopper video footage, the exiting "nose" of the alleged animated CGI airplane would be visible on top of (in front of) the explosion exiting the tower. A luma-key works off of the luminance (brightness) within the video signal. In order to see an airplane animation that has been sandwiched in between two duplicate layers of video from the same camera feed (3 layers altogether), the top layer would require portions of the image to be cut out, revealing the added airplane layer underneath. When this is done using a luma-key, a predetermined brightness threshold (limit) is set which will prevent any portion of the video image from showing that is brighter than that threshold, making those brighter portions disappear completely. In this case, the brightness threshold would have to be set to a point where it would eliminate the entire sky background (of the top layer only) while leaving the darker Twin Towers intact. The catch is that the flame, caused by the fuel explosion that erupts from the opposite side of the tower, is as bright as the sky. This means that the flame would also disappear just as the sky does, revealing the layer behind it which supposedly contains the animated plane and it's protruding nose. The fact that the flame does NOT disappear, that we see it covering and obscuring the "nose" of the plane, is proof that a luma key was not used.
In the video below, I demonstrate why the flame-over-nose in the live Fox chopper footage is a dead giveaway that Ace's luma-key theory is impossible.
Ace maintains that ALL the video clips of the 2nd plane that were broadcast live were fabricated using this luma-key compositing method, and that it's the only way it could have been done. Since I demonstrate by exactly replicating Ace's work that it contains an irreconcilable flaw which is observable in his own video--AND--considering that he ignored live video which, by his own criteria, would not work for live compositing, it's safe to say that Ace has debunked himself and that the LIVE video clips of the 2nd plane are indeed real.
Please be aware that Ace himself acknowledges that the point I make here rgarding the luma-key is correct, and so he attempts to explain away the problem with a contrived back-story. Read his excuse on his own research blog:
Please be aware that Ace himself acknowledges that the point I make here rgarding the luma-key is correct, and so he attempts to explain away the problem with a contrived back-story. Read his excuse on his own research blog:
– Wait a minute--according
to ACE--isn't the FOX Chopper5 footage supposed to be genuine footage that
"has been confirmed to have been shown LIVE" and which reveals a
"mistake" that we weren't supposed to see?
– So now
he's back-pedaling, claiming that the genuine live Fox chopper footage
is not genuine live footage! He says it was altered to cover the
mistake. It's just that when the perps covered the mistake, they didn't really
cover it, they just tried to make it look like it was supposed to be there by
adding a little flame to it (apparently thinking nobody would wonder how the
nose survived intact, or where it went after coming out the opposite
side).
– This also
means that the "perps" must have just simply hoped that
nobody out there (among the millions of potential audience members) was
recording the live broadcast who would have ended up with an incriminating copy
of the "real" live footage (which--amazingly--worked out for them
lucky perps!). Gee, that makes a lot of sense, Ace. Nice theory.
– There's
no wonder why Ace didn't include any of this information in his video. It makes
no frigging sense. If you
have been a believer in Ace's theory and are not upset by this significant omission, you should be.
If Ace Baker's theory is
correct and it's the "nose" of a computer generated plane animation
that can be seen exiting the opposite side of the tower, then why doesn't
the nose hold its shape?
The alleged nose can clearly be see
morphing and expanding as it exits. A computer generated graphic would not
do that.
See more on why the alleged "nose" is not the nose of the plane here:
Get more information on ALL existing 9/11 airplane video clips at:
http://www.911conspiracy.tv/2nd_hit.html Find out about the MANY existing still photos of the second plane here:
http://www.911conspiracy.tv/2nd_hit_photos.html
Watch my YouTube Amateur Video Playlist here:
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLk1HVK2Mg1KcS_Y3_xJmLxQfabVEvOEUG
There is NO PLANE IN THE WIDE SHOT in the Chopper5 video prior to the camera zooming-in as the chopper approaches the towers. - From 07 The Key (at 5:46)
FALSE. Ace's stabilization
of the video clip is flawed. You can easily tell by how jittery the station ID banner
looks in his stabilized footage. The I.D. banner, being a graphic overlay, serves as a perfectly stable point of reference. When Ace stabilizes the towers in the clip, the station I.D. graphic should have no more movement than did the buildings in the original clip. It should move in exactly the same manner, but in the reverse direction. However, in his "stabilized" clip, the station I.D. graphic is extremely jittery with exaggerated movement as compared to the original camera motion. The towers (and other buildings in the frame) were not jittery like that in the
original shot. This tells you his stabilization process was flawed. When done more accurately,
it looks like this:
In January of 2011, The Dataset Project published Release #14 comprising 942GB of video in original, full resolution, uncompressed, DV format, including numerous video clips of the 2nd plane.
For convenience, I have compiled many of the original quality airplane clips in one place for easy download. Though most of these clips are available in high quality for viewing on YouTube (see link to playlist below) keep in mind that all YouTube videos are compressed. Original format files are much too large for online streaming, so if you really want to see the original quality, you will have to download the large AVI files. Get the clips here:
https://www.filesanywhere.com/fs/v.aspx?v=8b6d6486586172bdab6a
Watch the YouTube playlist here:
http://www.911conspiracy.tv/NIST_FOIA.html
Ace Baker knows about these clips, but refuses to acknowledge them. In fact, it appears that he may have used some of them in his own videos, yet he maintains that he "offers a $100,000 reward to anyone who has an ORIGINAL QUALITY 9/11 airplane video". Obviously this is nothing more than a ploy and is a complete joke.
- Numerous high quality clips are also available for download from the NIST WTC Data Repository at: http://wtcdata.nist.gov/
- Various high quality clips from the NIST FOIA releases can be viewed on YouTube on the following channels:
1. First of all, the
size of the impact damage doesn't really increase following the fuel explosion. Ace
simply stops the clip before the extent of the impact damage becomes evident.
2. Secondly, the low resolution
of the video fails to show the detail of the impact hole. When compared to a
higher resolution photograph, it becomes clear that the "gaping
hole" is not so gaping. Much of what looks like a hole in the video is
simply where the outer aluminum cladding was blown off of the exterior of the
building, revealing the darker steel beams underneath.
There was no airplane debris below the impact zone. - Morgan Reynolds from 06 - What Planes? at1:43 (paraphrased).
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| Piece of fuselage from UA175 found on the roof of WTC5 apparently showing a portion of the plane's registration number as seen below (N612UA). |
.jpg)
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| An exterior column panel with aircraft wheel embedded in window. Photographed south of WTC1 at the intersection of Cedar and West St. |
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| Piece of AA11 fuselage photographed near West and Cedar Street. |
Evidence of Airplane Debris from the WTC
Read first-responder eyewitness accounts of airplane debris here:
There is a contradiction
between the Fairbanks and Hezarkhani videos that reveals a compositing error. The explosion
"puffballs" from the plane's impacting engines appear above the wings in one clip, but appear below the wings in the other. - From 07 The Key (at32:08)
FALSE. What
Ace ignores is the presence of a shadow being cast onto the building's south
face due to the easterly position of the sun. It is clear
that this is happening since the east face of the building is in direct
sunlight. Because of the sun's position, the shadow
on the south face would have a wedge-shape in relation to the building.
The above images are taken
from a blog entitled 9/11Physics Truth. The author gets it exactly right. Just prior to the
plane impacting the tower, it enters the shadow wedge on the south face of the
building.
From the position of Hezarkhani's camera (behind the impacting plane),
the "puffballs" appear as they should--below the
wings--exactly where the engine's impact the building. From the
Fairbanks camera position (underneath the
impacting plane), the visual effect of the shadow wedge comes into play. Only the extremities of the "puff balls" are lit by direct sunlight.
The rest of them are in the shadow, causing them to visually blend in with the shaded facade.
This creates the illusion that
they're above the wings, but they are not. There is no real discrepancy.
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| Above gif's originally posted by Ragasaias at pumpitout.com forum |
The impact and penetration of the 2nd plane into the South Tower as seen in video footage exhibits IMPOSSIBLE or "CARTOON" PHYSICS, and violates Newton's laws of motion. - From 06 What Planes? (at 2:25)
FALSE—at least
according to the numerous independent teams of research physicists and engineers who have actually studied the impacts, including
researchers from MIT's Crashworthiness Laboratory, The University of Akron,
Purdue University, Kajima Corp., etc. Detailed research using various
approaches and methods has been published by these researchers in various
peer-reviewed, professional and scientific journals. All of the
research is in 100% agreement that what is seen in the video footage of the WTC
attacks is not only possible, but expected according to the laws of physics.
Question: Do you know how much scientific research exists that supports the "impossible physics" claim?
Answer: ZERO.
See links
to the above mentioned research here:
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| Morgan Reynolds explains 9/11 "physics". |
Ace Baker interviews Morgan Reynolds about the impact
physics, someone who is not a physicist and who has no academic or professional background in applied physics. There's a reason why he doesn't
interview an actual physicist on the subject--he can't find one that
would agree with him. Even "truther" physicists Dr. Steven Jones and Dr. Gregory Jenkins have said that the no-planes "theory" is false.
Dr. Judy Wood, perhaps the ONLY "no-planer" qualified to actually address the subject (holding an advanced degree in applied physics), won't go near it, instead focusing on energy weapons from space, the dubious "Hutchinson Effect", and the role of off-shore hurricanes in the destruction of the twin towers. The reason for this is no mystery. If she could demonstrate, using physics, that the airplane penetrations of the Twin Towers were physically impossible, she would.
Morgan Reynolds talks about "physics", but doesn't ever provide any scientific data. What he offers are simply "appeals to common sense" and "arguments from incredulity", both of which are logical fallacies and have nothing to do with physics.
For more on WTC impact physics see:
Physicist Ryan Mackey's discussion of the WTC airplane impacts.
Ryan Mackey at www.911myths.com
Dr. Judy Wood, perhaps the ONLY "no-planer" qualified to actually address the subject (holding an advanced degree in applied physics), won't go near it, instead focusing on energy weapons from space, the dubious "Hutchinson Effect", and the role of off-shore hurricanes in the destruction of the twin towers. The reason for this is no mystery. If she could demonstrate, using physics, that the airplane penetrations of the Twin Towers were physically impossible, she would.
Morgan Reynolds talks about "physics", but doesn't ever provide any scientific data. What he offers are simply "appeals to common sense" and "arguments from incredulity", both of which are logical fallacies and have nothing to do with physics.
– If the
plane impacts, as seen in the video footage, truly exhibited a violation of
the laws physics, it shouldn't be too hard to prove. Physics is all about
mathematics. And math doesn't lie. If it could be demonstrated,
scientifically, that the plane impacts are impossible according to the laws of physics, then proving 9/11 was an inside job is a slam dunk, because
there is no possible explanation other than media manipulation and
deception.
– If Ace
Baker, Morgan Reynolds, and others believe that ALL the existing published
research using mathematical and/or computer models is FALSE, why don't
they try to prove it by funding their own research, creating their own
"accurate" scientific computer simulations (as opposed to
producing rock music videos which serve no purpose but to try to slander people
who disagree with their point of view)?
– There's a
reason why the truth movement hasn't done this. They CAN'T. If they could, they
would. And the reason is that their impossible physics claims cannot be
supported scientifically with physics.
For more on WTC impact physics see:
Physicist Ryan Mackey's discussion of the WTC airplane impacts.
Ryan Mackey at www.911myths.com
FALSE. Purdue researchers published
several articles containing data on the computer simulation project. Much
of the information can be found on Purdue's own webpage about the project. You can find citations for
the published articles in the above document link. They include, "Engineering Perspective of the Collapse of WTC-I." by Irfanoglu, A., &
Hoffmann, C. M., (2008), and "A high-quality, high-fidelity visualization of the September 11 attack on the World Trade Center", Rosen,
Paul, et al. (2008).
However, the most comprehensive information on the modeling of the simulation
can be found in a doctoral dissertation published in 2008 by engineer Ingo
Brachmann entitled "ON EFFICIENT MODELING OF HIGH-VELOCITY FLUID SOLID IMPACT". Brachmann is
credited for "Engineering Models" and "Simulation Setups"
on the project. His dissertation comprises 347 pages of data used
in Purdue's computer simulation of the North Tower plane impact.
Resources for further investigation:
Rebuttal of Ace Baker's "Chopper 5 Composite" Analysis (Salter 2007)9/11: The Absurdity of the No-Planes-in-New York Theory
www.911myths.com
Debunking 9/11 Conspiracy Theories
Debunked: Pilots for 9/11 truth WTC Speeds
Debunking "September Clues" and "No Plane" Theories
The Pentagon Attack: What the Physical Evidence Shows
American Airlines Flight 77 Evidence
The Idiocy Behind the '9/11 Truth' Movement
Conspiracy Theory and Conspiracism
Fallacies and Propaganda
* * *
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| Trust me. I'm an expert. And a Rock Star! |
____________________________________________________________
Jer-bo from youtube here. Great page man. Really detailed. I have an associates in applied science visual communication, but never used it and barely did any video editing, but all his claims and your debunk doesnt require a degree but common sense.
ReplyDeleteFyi, the NY1 vid didnt play, not sure if it was my ipad, just showed error loading.
Hey also, i never heard of the hutchinson effect. I found something that supports your site even more. That guy doesnt have any degrees according to this (ref below)
Hutchison came on the scene around 1979, but he has not been able to convince the scientific community that he is anything more than a crackpot. The same qualities that repulse the scientific community endear Hutchison to the mass media: the lone wolf genius with no degrees or academic background who shows the world you don't need no education to find a source of unlimited energy that costs nearly nuttin.
http://skepdic.com/hutchisonhoax.html
You might have a better source that proves he does have an degree, not sure. But this just makes it even better
Thanks and keep it up
JB,
DeleteThanks for the feedback. I appreciate any input you can offer to correct mistakes or make the info here more complete. I'll check out that link on Hutchison. What's funny is that Ace Baker hates John Hutchison and has devoted a lot of space on his blog debunking him. Check it out:
http://acebaker.blogspot.com/2008/03/judy-wood-falls-on-her-sword.html
http://acebaker.blogspot.com/2008/03/john-hutchison-is-fraud-part-2.html
Those no planers are among the most religious of 9/11 Truthers and they can't agree or get along at all--each sect accusing the others of being part of the "Controlled Opposition". It's amazing that they've been able to dupe so many people into buying "no-planes" on 9/11.
There is no genuine "No-Plane Theory". There are several proposals, but not one of them can stand on its own and/or account for the evidence, and they all contradict each other.
Saul, although you probably know that I hosted the 'Hardfire' debate between the lunatic Ace Baker and video compositing expert Steve Wright, you don't know that I have archived my e-mail exchanges with the invincibly ignorant Morgan Reynolds.
DeleteI'd be happy to share them with you.
Ron Wieck
Thanks for commenting. That sounds fascinating. If you're ever interested in writing a brief article summarizing that exchange I'd love to post it as, or part of, a Morgan Reynolds Fail blog entry.
DeletePerhaps I can provide something for you at a later date. The difficulty in engaging Morgan Reynolds stems from the fact that he is, above all, a fraud. I have often written that twoofers are characterized by stupidity, dishonesty, and insanity, in varying mixes. Ace Baker is a dogged liar, but his dishonesty proceeds from his mental illness.
DeleteReynolds, by contrast, is a respected economist who is wedded to nonsense regarding the jihadist attacks of 9/11. On some level, he understands that he peddles snake oil, as evidenced by his steadfast refusal to defend his crapola in debate.
Our exchanges invariably end with me asking him to run his fantasies by a physics teacher and him telling me that he doesn't need a physics teacher.
No progress is possible against closed minds.
I came here hoping that I could actually debunk Ace Baker but everything he said is exactly as he said was. WTF? Why are you acting like you debunked him when you didnt at all? He just made you look shady as hell. What gives?
Delete@ flagg. You're joking. Right?
DeleteThe author is right: there are live shots not taken into consideration by Ace. These live shots do not support Ace's theory but do not support the crashing-planes theory either.
DeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
DeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
DeleteEveryone knows that Ace Baker is a planted shill (Controlled opposition). He was given the job of making himself and other who know that No Planes were used look crazy. That is why he faked his Suicide on the Jim Fetzer show. So of course their are lots of errors and misconceptions in his video. You are you have debunked nothing!
DeleteThe energy of the aircraft is more than enough to damage the steel, but, because the aluminum is so much softer than steel, it breaks apart first, long before it reaches the point where the steel suffers any distortion. Here are the figures:
DeleteThe speed of air that will tear a plane apart at sea level densities is 500 mph.
At 500 mph air creates a force equal to 674 pounds per square foot.
If an aircraft is not carefully controlled in it's flight path, 500 mph air will rip it apart at a sea level air density of 14.7 psi.
Okay, so that's how strong or weak an aircraft is. now let's see how much force it takes to break a 14 inch box steel column.
Explosives experts will use a charge designed to move air at between 6818.2 mph and 20455 mph, which translates into forces of 125,370 pounds per square foot of pressure at the low end, to a high of 1,128,400 pounds per square foot of pressure respectively.
So we have Aircraft............ 674.23 lb/sq.ft
Steel box column:........125,370...... lb/sq.ft (low)
Steel box column: ......1,128,400.....lb/sq.ft (high)
Worse yet is the fact that the aircraft has to break several steel columns, not just one.
If the aircraft must break at any pressure above 674.23 lb/sq.ft. how
can it possibly stay intact and exert a force of over 125 thousand
pounds per square foot, to over 1 million pounds per square foot, on
the steel columns? That would be like saying that an egg could
penetrate a concrete wall if thrown hard enough. It can't. It will
crack open and spread it's force over a wide area, without ever even
coming close to generating the force needed to penetrate the concrete.
A 100 ton hollow ball of clay, moving at 500 mph, does have the energy needed to destroy a steel box column, but, because of it's softness/inability to withstand the pressure/forces needed to damage the column, it will never do any damage to the steel. Thus the plane becomes a "bug on the windshield" in effect, it splatters.
http://themindlesspraetorianblog.blogspot.com/
Yes where is the debunking that planes simply cannot fly this close to the ground at this speed?
DeleteNo planes were harmed in the making of the 9/11 disaster movie
DeletePeople can only believe the planes were real by ignoring all the physical evidence provided by the psychopaths responsible.
DeleteThe "conspiracy theory" moniker is a convenient way to water down, and side step any claims that go against a story somebody else has. Very convenient. That way, people, like this guy, can make themselves sound legitimate, such as charle's manson crime saga of Laurel canyon, keep on-a-goin' for the masses. In reality, if you say something happened, or happened a certain way, and I make a claim that what you say, didn't happen, that's not called a "theory". I'm callin' you a liar. Therefore, that's my CLAIM. Claim being the proper term. Accusation is the other correct term. In other words, I don't have a theory, or "conspiracy theory" that you, and the throng of the likes of you, in your camp, are liars. I'm callin' you liars. It's quite that simple.
DeleteHi Saul,
ReplyDeleteYour deconstruction of Ace Baker is very well done. You left the URL on my article on No-Planes Disinformation at the Hybridrogue1 blog on the 9th of July.
I have a suspicion that you are someone who believes the majority of the official story about 9/11. I dispute that official story in other articles on my blog, while also disputing the 'crackpot theories' that are sort of the other pincer to the tongs making up the Psyops of 9/11.
If you would read through the deductive argument put to the destruction of the WTC due to controlled demolition on my blog, I think I can convince you that the towers and bldg 7 were indeed demolished by explosives:
http://hybridrogue1.wordpress.com/2014/05/08/controlled-demolition-and-the-demise-of-wtc-on-911/
Thanks again for a great article and for commenting on my blog,
Willy Whitten - \\][//
Plane vs wooden shed. The crash occurs at the six minute mark.
Deletehttp://themindlesspraetorianblog.blogspot.com/2016/03/911-fake-as-seen-on-tv.html
By the way Saul,
ReplyDeleteYour comments were in the moderation queue for several days, because I rarely receive comments from those I haven't already vetted on my blog.
They are public now, and any other comments you would like to add are welcome, and should show up as you post them.
\\][//
The Jesuit order owns you people. As you bicker and fight, you are property. The American people will be disarmed in the future. Debunk that after it happens.
ReplyDeleteToo much weed. Take it easy for a while. You'll be alright.
DeleteDo you believe in a controlled demolition at all? So much work to discredit one man, much work but little wisdom.
ReplyDeleteDo you also believe we went to the moon? And do you believe in the Bang Theory also? You heard of Operation Paperclip? Vatican Ratlines? Lots of work still to do
WHY PLANES WERE NOT USED
Deletehttp://killtown.blogspot.com/2007/05/why-they-didnt-use-planes-to-hit-wtc.html
Killclown is a total fool, and planes WERE used.
Deletehttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44cFTrfjIfM&list=PL5D236082CC0EFB63&index=14&t=0s
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
ReplyDeleteThe debris of the plane existed! They were collected immediately by the first responders and now are stored at... who cares?
DeleteHow can there possibly be any debris from an explosion that supposedly vaporized the titanium engines!!!! How on earth do you think that a piece of landing gear with RUBBER Tyre would survive? Any 'debris' was planted during the chaos, as it was on the perfectly manicured Pentagon lawn. :D
DeleteLet's ignore all the footage for a moment and concentrate on one very important key fact;
DeleteIt is IMPOSSIBLE for THAT type of plane to fly at THAT speed at THAT altitude without it breaking apart. On that basis, ANY video footage showing that it not only manages to do THAT but then also manages to defy almost every scientific law by flying almost directly through numerous steel columns HAS to be deemed as fake, does it not?
'Fly on windscreen' people....'fly on windscreen. ;)
"Let's ignore all the footage . . ."
DeleteWhen you have a theory--in this case that "it is IMPOSSIBLE for THAT type of plane to fly at THAT speed at THAT altitude without it breaking apart"--and then you have hard evidence (lots of it) that contradicts your theory, you should revise or discard your theory. That is the scientific method. You do not discard the evidence. When you dismiss evidence in order to preserve your theory, you are practicing religion, not science.
Dr Judy Wood hits the nail on the head! 9/11 was and still is an Inside job!
ReplyDeleteJudy Wood is a proven nutjob
DeleteVery interesting, but I felt Ace's most compelling points were either not disproven or ignored completely. The cartoon physics was " debunked" by simply claiming some univerity studies say it's possible. Not very convincing. Also you left out anything about the wake vortex (or lack there of)
ReplyDeleteVery interesting that you're more impressed with opinion and speculation regarding the impact physics from people (Reynolds and Baker) who have no education, background, experience, or credibility in the field, than you are with several scientific/experimental studies from experienced research physicists working independently. Seriously?
DeleteAs for the wake vortices, I also disagree with you. To me, that was one of the weakest of Baker's arguments. He shows you video clips of wake vortices from planes flying in typical kinds of conditions. But planes hitting the towers at full speed resulted in massive explosions. I think it's very likely that the pressure wave from such a violent explosion would have dwarfed any residual wake vortices in the air.
Also i disagree with Dr. Wood on the "wing tips" claim", as it is clear in photos that columns are not broken where the tips should have entered. It looks like the aluminum cladding is cut but not the columns. Now, if the wing tips did not cut through the columns, where did they go exactly? You can't have both ways
DeleteStill waiting....
Delete"if the wing tips did not cut through the columns, where did they go exactly?"
DeleteThe plane was shredded upon impact. Aluminum splinters when it impacts at high speeds. Any sections of the wings that did not enter the building, fragmented into a cloud of aluminum confetti. This is evident in the video footage.
So if the plane shredded upon impact, then it couldn't have cut any core columns. If the core columns remained intact, why did the buiding collapse? After all, it was designed to withstand multiple strikes from a 707 @ 600mph.
DeleteBtw, if you watch the impact in slow motion you can clearly see the plane disappear into the building without making an entry wound, then smoke puffs, then explosion. So the plane goes inside the building without leaving a scratch, then an explosion, and we're left a big plane sized hole. An obvious sign of an outward explosion.
DeleteSounds like you cracked the case. Congrats!
DeleteSounds like you're using sarcasm to avoid giving an intelligent rebuttal, because you obviously can't. The truth is you cannot deny the overwhelming amount of evidence of the no-plane theory.
DeleteSeriously, if the plane shredded upon impact then how were the core columns cut??????
Delete"The truth is you cannot deny the overwhelming amount of evidence of the no-plane theory."
DeleteHa HA! That's a good one.
"if the plane shredded upon impact then how were the core columns cut??????"
When the plane fragments into pieces, all that matter (the pieces) don't just disappear, and neither does the kinetic energy. Perhaps you should watch the FEA simulations that I posted at the bottom of this page:
http://debunkingnoplanes.blogspot.com/2014/04/scientific-research-on-physics-of-world.html
You did NOT successfully debunk Baker's stabilization evidence. The graphics an logos bounced around precisely BECAUSE Baker properly stabilized the image. Those were burned onto the original video and therefore moved with the background. If those logos had NOT moved, then the video wouldn't be stabilized. This was a videotape, which did not contain a separate layer for graphics. You clearly don't understand what stabilization actually is or does.
ReplyDeleteI believe you misunderstood my argument regarding the stabilization. I agree that the I.D. banner should move around in the stabilized footage, what I'm saying, though, is the movement should be exactly proportionate to the movement of the objects in the original (unstabilized) footage. This is not the case. The jittery motion of the banner graphic in his stabilized clip is exaggerated compared to the original camera movement, evincing that the stabilization is flawed. I believe there are several reasons for this, and that it might not be intentional on the part of Baker, but I believe that he understands the limitations to his stabilization "evidence", but chooses to conceal them from his audience.
DeleteI've gone back and watched Baker's stabilization a couple of times and I see no evidence that the banner graphic is more jittery than the original camera movement. I think what you are perceiving may be an illusion created by the fact that we generally see footage like this where the graphic is fixed and our brains tolerate quite a lot of subject bouncing in the frame due to camera movement. This has actually become a videographic style in it's own right - by using handhelds and intentionally moving them around to create a "realistic" effect for TV shows, movies etc.
DeleteBut what we virtually never see is a graphic or logo floating around, so maybe it merely seems more jittery to you. We should simply ignore the graphics and focus on the tower images. They do seem to be perfectly stabilized, yet the plane seems to drift in quick jerky motions. I cannot figure this out unless he somehow manipulated the real plane in the stabilized footage - thus essentially faking a fake. Maybe that's what he did. It seems odd though, since he appears genuinely adamant about his position, and seems to believe his own story. But then, some people will go to extreme lengths to gain acceptance. He has shown himself to be extremely callous towards all of the other evidence showing the absurdity of his claims. I do love the music video though! Please share your several reasons why you believe his stabilization is flawed.
I guess we'll have to disagree on this one. To me it appears obvious that the jitteriness of the banner graphic is dissimilar to the smooth motion of the camera which is equipped with gyroscopic stabilization.
DeleteI think there are several reasons why stabilizing that footage is problematic. The low resolution/low quality (Ace was using footage from a VHS recording) and the fact that the chopper was miles away increase the likelihood of errors, i.e., the towers themselves are actually not that stable within the frame. There are atmospheric distortions as well as thermal distortions (due to the heat from the fire), not to mention the wind which can cause some movement. This is why when I stabilized the footage, I used a higher resolution clip and used foreground buildings as reference points rather than the towers themselves. And I got a much different, more accurate result.
about "stabilization": when you upload a clip on the you tube channel, they usually ask you if you would like to stabilize your video. i find it staged (someone either left them on purpose like that or they were doctored to look more amateurish) that all those so called "amateur 9/11 videos" frames are still shaking.
DeleteThe fake, and staged, Evan Fairbanks "video clip" is pathetic enough in and of itself, to completely trah this entire circus act known as "9-11", and the roman catholic numerology that goes with it. As if the "pentagon" and Shanksville hole in the ground wasn't enough to do that already.
DeleteBTW, the reason I posted the previous comment is not because I'm an Ace Baker supporter. Quite the contrary. The stabilization argument was actually the ONLY of his no-plane evidence that I could not find a flaw in. Clearly it's impossible for chopper 5 to have been "live composited" because it would require a mask for the "exit flame" layer (plus the visual corroboration inso many other videos). How he ever could have not addressed that is beyond me since it ruins his entire theory. Here's another point that should be added to the implausibility of chopper 5 having been faked: Later in chapter 7, Ace discusses the use of the orange flashes as a way for having synchronized the collision in time and space between all the various videos which show the flashes. Actually, this is an interesting explanation which would make sense if the videos actually had been composited. I think this may be part of the reason Ace can't get over himself. It is brilliant, but it's just not true since these all could not have been so perfectly composited that they all corroborate each other. But the problem, for those that are buying into the no planes theory, is that there would be no reference point for insertion of a faked plane layer in either time OR space that would allow "compositraitors" to perfectly place the plane/expulsion behind the real fireball. BTW, Ace admits on the Hardfire show that the fireball was real in the chopper 5 video. So he's really just contradicting himself all over the place.
ReplyDeleteno planes 9/11 is correct.
ReplyDeleteToo bad the vast majority of the witnesses in your Oral History link do not say they saw a plane. I sampled 25 or so names and found only one (the first name on the list) who said they saw a plane. The others heard about the plane from people who saw it on TV, from rumors in the street, etc. So there appear to only be a handful, maybe 10-20 in that list, who claim to have seen a plane. Studies show that fake video will convince upwards of 50% of witnesses will say they saw something they didn't if shown fake video afterwards.
ReplyDeleteAlso, a very large number of firefighters who did say they saw a plane probably just saw the explosion and then assumed there had been a plane. At the time the interviews were given virtually no one was questioning the existence of the plane. So if you saw the explosion or even smoke afterwards, you'd say you saw the plane hit, because you're assuming the existence of the plane. Like in all the 'amateur' videos, where no one reacts to the plane, they only react after the explosion happens.
ReplyDeleteYour speculations are meaningless, but thanks for your opinion.
DeleteGreat website – very impressive work! Dick Eastman has battled the "no-planers" (Morgan Reynolds, Judy "Space Beams" & the gang) and their fallacies/lies/obfuscations for years. Here's a radio debate where Eastman demolishes no-planer Jim Fetzer – enjoy: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P_x7-W4mndc
ReplyDeletehttps://ancientparasite.blogspot.com/2022/07/911-and-video-compositing-theory.html
DeleteGreat work here. I was just curious about tower 7 because it was obviously pre-wired for demolition, which ended up being a real blessing. Are all new buildings pre-wired these days?
ReplyDeleteBuilding 7 wasn't pre-wired for demolition. It was simply hit by Tower One.
DeleteThe "No Planers" are dogmatic and banned me from questioning the No Plane hypothesis on Facebook's "All Theories Welcome" group. There is more than 1 reason to fake photos. We do not have to jump to the "no planes" conclusion. Any outcome that is against the official story that planes entered the WTC and burst into flames would be a reason to fake photos. If the plane parts fell to the ground that would be a reason. Thousands of plane parts were found outside the WTC walls. I linkes to your page from http://ANETA.org/planes
ReplyDeleteSomeone paid you to write this 'debunking'.
ReplyDeletethat's a pretty good call, I admit. This s.o.b. went to quite a bit-o-work to slap this trash up. You know, keep it in order and everything. Either that, or this guy gets a pat on the head by the jesuit faculty at Georgetown or Trump, or Drumpf's, or whatever that fraud's name is, or buddies at fordham.
DeleteI think history itself is a lie:
ReplyDeleteFollow the very real paper trail of treaties and government constitutions all the way back in time....learn how the aristocracy still exists in more ways than you may know-
http://www.aamorris.net/properganderatpropaganda/2016/5/9/the-overlooked-theatre-fake-wars
I'd love to comment and debate this point by point. The only problem is this is a vetted blog, which makes is a bully pulpit with you having the last word. My father taught me a long time ago never to agree with a fool, because people wouldn't be able to tell the difference. If you're ever man enough to debate me one-on-one without the power to moderate or edit my responses, then let me know.
ReplyDeleteSounds like excuses. The only comments I delete are spam and hate speech. If you can prove anything I've said on here is incorrect, not only will I allow you to post it, I will correct it.
DeleteAs a flight attendant at the time of 9/11 I would ask, what happened to our flight crews in this theory? As well as our passengers? These are people we know don't exist anymore after that day. It's fine to do a mental exercise in pseudo-science but what about the people we knew that are gone? There is always a psychological denial after a mass tragedy especially when seen in person. (Now on TV.) It's a coping mechanism within PTSD. (People who saw the Hindenburg fire were referred to as "the witnesses" and treated kindly many years later.) But really why not use planes?
DeleteAll this informations is really good, i've never heard something like this and i think it is a little bit conspiratorial but really nice post, I enjoy it a lot
ReplyDeleteThank you for sharing such great information. It has help me in finding out more detail about Live Video!
ReplyDeleteAlso if no planes were used then where did the passengers that so happened to disappear on that day go? What's next? 9/11 never happened?
ReplyDeletei call bs...planes crashed into building, end
ReplyDeletenothing else is to be said...just let it go
ReplyDelete15 years ago and people still cant accept the fact
ReplyDeleteYou can't debunk the No Planes Theory. It's obvious there were no planes. Any fool can see that!
ReplyDeleteOn the contrary; Anybody can debunk the No Planes theory, because there WERE planes. Only fools claim otherwise.
DeleteAt least Ace Baker puts his name to his claims where is yours?
ReplyDeleteI put the facts right in front of you, complete with references for the info provided. My name is irrelevant.
Deletefirst of is the author here saying none of the videos are clearly faked, and that the black screens regarding Pinocchio's nose happen? two other point,can we do a scientific comparison regarding the shape of the supposed nose as it first appears to the nose of the plane that appears in the video up to that point? and second are going to say the supposed nose that first appears seems distinct and hold its shape and then change rather suddenly into smoke?
ReplyDeleteIf you look around my blog here, you might find answers to some of the questions you're asking.
Deletehttp://debunkingnoplanes.blogspot.com/2014/05/the-nose-out-fallacy.html
I don't need you or your pathetic videos to explain anything whatsoever to me, liar. You M. Hezarkhani goofy, and cheaply concocted airplane, timed to meet up with the building about the time of the detonation, has already been exposed as the fraud that it is. That goes for all the other cheap video phone trash videos, promoted by their crisis acting whores to promote this farce as well. Your 9-11 hoax is even worse than NASA's fake "moon" landings and space walk/s.
DeleteI would like to know more about the university studies quoted here which purport solid science that the behavior of the plane's exterior configuration is expected behavior according to the laws of physics Certainly some rudimentary explanation of the criteria they used must be available the the laymen or moderately informed interested party. Do we have some kind of quantifiable data in terms of the resistance of the exterior mesh. Whatever quantity was used it would interesting if these researchers could formulate that estimate to the resistant force in a way that would correlate with the expected resistance at the pentagon? It seems to be automatically assumed the nose of the plane went through between the floors therefore avoiding the more serious resistance of the three feet thick concrete slab floors? Did they do separate comparisons for the resistance of the floors compared to the relative open space between the floors as opposed to the slabs? Why not include the actual links to the research as well
ReplyDeletehttp://debunkingnoplanes.blogspot.com/2014/04/scientific-research-on-physics-of-world.html
DeleteNeither of my question here were answered. the question were in regard to intact columns where the plane went through, supposedly. and what kind of criteria are used to determine the amount of resistance of various parts of the building in a scientifically quantifiable manner
Deleteand finally maybe somebody could tell me the outline of the damage to the facade of the towers would not have to include the entire outline of the plane. One can argue that additional lateral damage to the facade could have occurred but that does not change the question of whether a minimum correspondence of damage that coincides wit the areas of penetration by the plane must exist. In other rather simplistic words where we saw the plane go trough the building the buildings face can no longer inhabit that region Yes on No?
ReplyDeletehttp://debunkingnoplanes.blogspot.com/2014/07/911-no-planes-fail-blog-dr-judy-wood.html
DeleteSo my reply above was in regard to this post, so sorry about the mistake.While this link has nice shots and can outline a lot of the planes suppose penetration, it is clearly missing the tips the planes the vertical stabilizer etc. Why not superimpose the image of the plane over the hole. Instead of just rough drawings
DeleteYou actually have the gall to dredge up the controlled opposition transvestite whore, known as "judy wood" [lol] into this to "support" your point?
Deleteyou just want to cover up the fact, This "incident" only reason the US government to invade the middle east.
ReplyDeleteGood article BUT your diligence identifying of all the aircraft components has now thrown a serious shadow over the supposed aircraft attack at the Pentagon and the downed plane in Pennsylvania - where are the same bits - I worked on Douglas DC 8's for the first 6 years of my working life back in the late 60's - where are the engine turbine sections normal operating temperature 1100 degrees C- where are the supposed aircraft tail sections sticking up in the air like we always see in crash sights in the USA - these attacks where at ground level "targets" they could/may not be buried under 650,000 tons of steel (per tower) as in New York - where are the BITS????? - I have been aboard a downed DC8 within hours after it hitting the ground killing 2 members of the Training grew and spreading it's self over 800 yards adjacent to the main runway and breaking into three (3) major body groups- WHERE ARE THE BITS at the Pentagon and sunny pastoral Pennsylvania
ReplyDeleteSeriously? So the US chooses to kill 4,000 or its own citizens, not to mention overseas tourists, in order to justify an invasion of the Middle East? Why not just fake some emails or doctor video of "jihadists" making threats?
DeleteIf you seriously think your government is so batshit insane it would deliberately kill thousands of its own citizens - regardless of the reason - then why on earth do you still live there? I would hightail my way out as fast as I could!
But then again, I live in Australia, where we live in peace with a strong democracy, a good education system, free universal health care, no guns, very little religion and no people who are insane enough to seriously think their government wants to kill them.
I'd advise you to move somewhere like here. Not here, but somewhere like here.
If you live in Australia - you've been under the rule of Chinese Communism for the last 10 years - And the fun is just beginning. Why do you stay in a Country that is being so thoroughly gutted by the Chinese Commies?? Are you crazy???
DeleteThe one thing I have never understood about the no planes theory. Is that the effort required to simulate the effects of a plane crashing into a tower seems huge, holograms, disguised drones, beams from space etc.etc.etc..
ReplyDeleteMaybe I'm lazy but if I were a government looking to stage a suitable horrific attack, I would just find a set of lunatics prepared to fly a plane into a building, and the suitably inspire/encourage/fund/train them to do so. Far cheaper than laser beams from space and no messing about with holograms or SEAL teams to plant explosives. But hey i'move just lazy
Welshman, Are you saying that flying commercial airliners full of people into buildings full of people simply requires "a set of lunatics" that you would encourage & train - and that would be "far cheaper" that sticking CGI's into the video of the buildings blow out from the inside???? Do elaborate Welshman.
DeleteAnd that's exactly what they did.
ReplyDeleteThe only problem being that the terroist pilots accused of committing the crimes were in no way capable of pulling off such incredibly tight manuvoures in such craft. The official 9/11 account has so many holes you might mistake it for cheese.
Try this for scientific evidence and then try to argue it wasn't anything else but an inside job:
https://youtu.be/xqqelDq4P48
Video not available. But I don't have to read that to know it WASN'T an inside job.
DeleteThe "airliner" hit a section of the Pentagon that had just been "re-modeled". Forensic Accountants, investigating $4.5 Trillion missing from the Defense Dept, were, coincidentally, moved into that space a few weeks before 9/11.. They all were murdered by explosives planted by the "workers". The investigation into the missing $4.5 Trillion was dropped after 9/11. Several Pentagon employees who witnessed the explosion at the Pentagon are on video saying; "THERE WAS NO PLANE, NO WINGS, NO FUSELAGE, NO JET ENGINES, NO LUGGAGE & NO BODIES. Those videos and much more have since been removed from YouTube.
DeleteI don't believe in the plane images at all whatsoever... what we we're told and shown is a fairy tale
Deletehttps://ancientparasite.blogspot.com/2022/07/911-and-video-compositing-theory.html
maybe youre right on some of the unimportant details, but a 767 can't fly at that speed at sea level, not even in a dive, and if it was trying it would certainly need to choose the perfect line at the beginning because any change in direction would surely rip it to shreds.
ReplyDeleteThen once it would touch 44 steel columns and 7 or 8 one acre concrete slabs with giant spandrel plates in front of them it would be smashed to bits while barely damaging the building and then it would fall to the ground outside the building.
That makes you a lying sack of crap, debunker doofus.
When you have a theory--in this case that " a 767 can't fly at that speed at sea level, not even in a dive"--and then you have hard evidence (lots of it) that contradicts your theory, you should revise or discard your theory. That is the scientific method. You do not discard the evidence. When you dismiss evidence in order to preserve your theory, you are practicing religion, not science.
DeleteExactly. Aluminum airliners don't pass through structural steel beams and reinforced concrete without breaking up. Anytime I've detailed the events of that day - my comments have been removed.
DeleteA very good job on all points, except the puff ball. Fairbanks had his camera taken away from him. It was returned to him after more than a week. The puff anomaly very likely was not discovered, but as put there to be found to give some basis for the no-planes justice-obstructing falsehood to have something empirical on its side. It is falsified evidence. Morgan Reynolds worked in the White House with Ted Olsen and Karl Rove. Reynolds knew of me from 1980 when we were at Texas A & M. In March of 2002 I was presenting evidence that Boeing 757 flew over the Pentagon as something else struck from a slightly different direction -- and the evidence was solid. They could not contradict the evidence or the implications. Also, in 2006, Dr. Steven Jones had just discovered thermite in the WTC dust. Then it was that Fetzer and Reynolds appeared, trapping Jones into attaching himself to Fetzer with Scholars for 9-11 Truth -- at which point Fetzer began discrediting the organization by bringing in Rosalee Grable, Gerard Holmgren and Rosalee Grable followed by Reynolds saying that no planes hit the WTC. The planes were directed by remote control and there was a definite stand-down -- so the idea was to mislead and confuse and frustrate the public with the absurd claim that the 50 videos were tampered with and all of the witnesses were liars. When people like you were willing to do the work to patiently expose the deceptions, Fetzer created a fall-back position, that everyone saw holograms. BUT DEFINITELY THE CRIME INCLUDED THE TACTICS TO OBSTRUCT JUSTICE, AND FALSE THEORIES WAS THEIR PRIMARY RELIANCE. The puff was edited to appear as though behind the wing in the Fairbanks video. Justice requires finding those who took Fairbanks' camera and from them finding everyone who worked on it.
ReplyDeleteanother CIA site !
ReplyDeleteWhether is was planes or not it helps to get into the VERY sick mindset of the REAL perps behind this 9/11 false flag. As was written up in their Neocon (Jewish) Project for a New American Century, they needed a 'new Pearl Harbour'. What featured in that? Why kamikaze pilots flying airplanes into things (IMAGE!!!]
ReplyDeleteSo they NEEDED/NEED the IMAGE of planes flying into the phallic number 11 (a fave 'power number' of these criminals who are also into the occult).
THIS is why all evidence of BOMBS was and still is suppressed concerning how ALL the buildings came down. First time in history that one, ...t w o, THREE steel structured towers came down due to fire in ONE city, on ONE day. You don't even get this sht in James Bond movies and they are pretty far fetched, to say the least.
So yeah, they HAD, HAD, to have success in instilling the IMAGE into the public psyche of planes flying into the Towers. Towers of course also having enormous mythical and occult significance.
9/11 was no false flag, and PNAC wanted the government to rebuild their defenses WITHOUT a "new Pearl Harbor." Furthermore, the "new Pearl Harbor" didn't necessarily have to be the 9/11 attacks. It could've been the Millennial Bombing if that hadn't been thwarted. Or it could've been a USS Cole-style attack on Newport News, Virginia. Or it could've just as easily been some of the attempted attacks that were thwarted after the 9/11 attacks.
DeleteAnd the alleged "evidence of bombs" isn't being suppressed. It's simply not real.
Anonymous Person, You are a disgusting little worm. The folks you represent will come for naive operatives like yourself FIRST. You and your family will be packed onto a cattle car and sent off to work camp. No need to pack.
DeleteThe "folks" the s.o.b. representing, being the likes of Drumpf's, and all the rests', jesuit order superiors that guide them. And that being headquartered art the vatican, as per author Avro Manhattan. He exposes this in any one of his books kept out of "schools".
DeleteThey made a really big mistake here. The engine shown flying over and landing on Murry street is not only the wrong engine (it is the engine from a 747 lol) but even worse... It's 4 feet wide. Now the box columns of the blgd are 16 inches on 40 inch centers.
ReplyDeleteThat means there is only 2 feet between them. So how does a 4.ft engine pass between them without breaking one?
The answer of course is it cannot. Therefore it had to be planted.
And just how exactly do you think "they" could've planted it? Did they dig up Andre the Giant from his grave and raise him from the dead so he'd carry it there and hope nobody would notice. Or did they use a forklift and think nobody would pay attention? You claims about all there parts being "planted" have no logic.
DeleteYou are pathetic, aren't you? People unload equipment off of trucks that are covered with tarp all the time. You have construction and handlers in the streets, especially after H.A.A.R.P.'ed hurricanes, loaded with parts and equipment where the likes of you don't have the first clue as to what they're doing, or no doing. No difficult to place anything at any construction site, or any site, for that matter. Nobody stands around scrutinizing trucks and other equipment on the streets, jerkoff. People try to avoid these areas or get through quickly.
DeleteI noticed many of the comments involve the use of character assassination. So instead of debating the forensic science from 911, and in learning from this evidence. The naysayers attack the people that are actually seeking truth to find answers to the questions! Involving the flight envelop of the aircraft, the aircraft flight capabilities at flying near to sea level with the engines, the flight surfaces to control flight at recorded air speed. No recorded vortex seen from video revealing the wing flight surfaces. Involving the laws of physics for every action there is a equal and opposite reaction. Ever seen when a high speed car hit an oak tree? Never have I seen the car go thru the oak tree. I see where the car wraps around the main trunk of the tree, This is called physics. The laws of physics do not change from one day to another! But what we seen on 9/11 is impossible regarding the laws of physics. But to this day many Americans have chosen to be willingly ignorant to this information. Even in the bible Jesus makes a very revealing statement. My people perish for a lack of knowledge! This is what we are actually dealing with. Instead of questioning anything you are told, instead of investigating, looking with a critically eye to learn truth, many have decided to just go along with the crowd. To assume that this crowd has all the answers, that there all right in anything they state!
ReplyDeleteYou cannot be more correct, good work.
DeleteThe collection of videos at the link below will enable you to figure with a high degree of confidence, who perpetrated 911
https://tinyurl.com/yartg423
Be sure to see:
"fake as seen on tv"
https://tinyurl.com/yas89pa7
Marine, Since you wrote that, a coup has been perpetrated here in America. A coup is; "a sudden, illegal seizure of power". There's no doubt that the election was stolen and there's no doubt that 9/11 was a false flag hoax.. To me; Commies infiltrating our entire Government - INCLUDING THE SUPREME COURT - is far more devastating. We've been suckered.
Deletehttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_government_operations_and_exercises_on_September_11,_2001 Seems to be more monumental coincidences that also landed at the exact right place, exact right time, in the exact type of way that makes it even more of a coincidence. This would explain lack of response during and even after attacks, not to mention the immediate disaster and rescue response needed to minimize potential outsider help... and hasten the cleanup that had it taken longer, would have increased potential for more eyeballs and investigation. It's just fascinating theory... coincidences and stuff...
ReplyDeleteAll these 911 no plane debunking pages also fail to mention building 7. It was said according to NIST, that after the Twin towers "collapsed" it caused fires in building 7 and resulted in building 7 "collapsing". But what about other buildings that were even closer to the Twin towers? Why didn't those buildings catch fire and "collapse" at free fall speed?
ReplyDeleteBuilding 7 housed the Emergency Command Center for NYC. It also housed the ONLY Government computer on the planet that contained the information that would allow forensic accountants to trace $4.5 Trillion (Trillion) that was missing from the Defense Dept. That mammoth super computer had to be destroyed - it was, when Building 7 went down via controlled demolition. Everyone of the forensic accountants working on finding the missing money - were killed in the 9/11 Pentagon explosion. Coincidence??? I think not. BTW - There is not a single photo of an airliner at The Pentagon or Shanksville. Both airliners vanished on contact.
ReplyDeleteThat's correct. People, in the lands of the ignorant, still dANCE and prance around the empty hole at Shanksville, and NOBODY has anything to try and slick their way out of it. The perps figured everybody would be fixated on this twin tower drama to notice shanksville. The liars were, and are, right.
DeleteThese "debunkers" are probably gov agents and are full of sht. Ace is right.
ReplyDeleteHow & why did bldg 6 blow up before the towers fell? How did the gold disappear.? We are not all stupid.
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ReplyDeletewhen it comes to manipulation of luminance key, there is either Mask in after effects or cutting top layer,,,,,.. Turning the regular brightness down on the background(3rd) layer opposite to what (1st)top layer is after luminance key or completely dark so that you have a dark layer on the bottom and bright layer on top. When ace copies the tower video that makes two bright layers being put together again after keying is applied. Darken the bottom layer so that you will have a dark layer,bright layer instead of bright layer,bright layer.
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ReplyDeleteDark layer bright layer is going to destroy this and mark conlins page..
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